"Smile too much, and you will be questioned for not being serious enough" → this is spot on, and it's incredibly hard to maintain this balance. I meet a lot of potential clients / VCs / founders — 90% are male. That is already quite irritating, and the root cause is quite clear. You highlighted an interesting aspect of complexity with motherhood that I can only imagine for now, but another angle of complexity lies in combination with ageism (towards both sides — either looking too young and not representing the authority, or already too old to be competent in the fast-moving IT landscape).
Thank you, Elena. It's so frustrating that so much feedback for women has almost nothing to do with performance and almost everything to do with how everyone else arounds you feels about you. Especially when the same logic almost never applies to men. And when being "data-driven" is a point of pride with most companies.
However, I have not had the same experience you've had upon reaching VP/executive levels where your forthrightness is welcomed and seen as an asset. Almost the opposite. The difference in the ways that men and women were evaluated and valued became even more noticeable to me when reaching director-level roles, something I know a lot of my fellow hags have also experienced.
Not that I hadn't been diminished and told to smile earlier in my career. I definitely have (and worse). But as I progressed, I experienced a kind of increased psychological double-dealing. The only way I can explain it is that as a director or above, you pose more of a threat.
Obviously different people will have different experiences. But at least for me and a lot of others I know, this kind of stuff can get worse in some ways with seniority, not better.
Thank you for this, Elana. I'm stuck in the middle part, where aggressiveness is frowned upon, even as male colleagues around me are rewarded for the same behavior. It's hard to stay motivated.
I feel a lot of this in my bones. Thank you for writing on it. Depressingly, the modern workplace - and society - is still set up to see men as natural leaders, and women as their natural supporters.
Completely with you and Adam Grant in terms of the effectiveness of 'weak language' (and a sign of EQ) and I recognise him as an ally in helping women progress + receive equal opportunities. Nevertheless that NYT article of his on the topic kinda irritated me a little. I wrote about why on my own Substack - would love to know what anyone else interested in this topic thinks: https://emmakriskinans.substack.com/p/the-business-book-all-working-women
Thank you for sharing. I was told I was "too aggressive" and "too competitive" earlier in my career as an IC and it was truly unfair. Now as an exec, it's seen as "assertive" and valued.
This made me smile! We can all connect to these for-your-own-good-and-personal-growth feedback about "softening up", smiling more, being less direct.
Not sure when I decided to own it and make it part about my introduction: I am direct, assertive, this is how I engage and communicate and these are my strengths. Freeing!
I feel the pain, especially earlier in my career and family life. However, as my kids grow up, I find myself falling into another trap - team mom. The one who manages everyone's feelings and cleans up all the messes. I read another woman called it the "work housework".
This article really highlights the no win situation of middle management especially for women. Your story should give others the confidence to know you can push through, you just need an organisation worthy of your talents.
The feminist in me doesn’t want to take your advice - it’s sad that women have to modify their language so as not to offend men. We can’t smile too much because that make us look weak but we can’t be assertive either. As usual, we can’t fulfill either expectation. As another poster said, the rules of this game need to change.
I think ‘weak language’ is probably someone everyone should learn (guys and girls) 👀 All of the harshness can get quite exhausting. Even for men, I bet!
I’ve gone through the highs and lows myself (too assertive, too junior, too this and that). This post could’ve saved me time. I’ll be recommending it.
"Smile too much, and you will be questioned for not being serious enough" → this is spot on, and it's incredibly hard to maintain this balance. I meet a lot of potential clients / VCs / founders — 90% are male. That is already quite irritating, and the root cause is quite clear. You highlighted an interesting aspect of complexity with motherhood that I can only imagine for now, but another angle of complexity lies in combination with ageism (towards both sides — either looking too young and not representing the authority, or already too old to be competent in the fast-moving IT landscape).
We need to change the rules of this game.
It's so, so true. Can we all have an inner Elena please?
Thanks for posting this brutal truth, Elena. Always appreciate your writing.
Thank you, Elena. It's so frustrating that so much feedback for women has almost nothing to do with performance and almost everything to do with how everyone else arounds you feels about you. Especially when the same logic almost never applies to men. And when being "data-driven" is a point of pride with most companies.
However, I have not had the same experience you've had upon reaching VP/executive levels where your forthrightness is welcomed and seen as an asset. Almost the opposite. The difference in the ways that men and women were evaluated and valued became even more noticeable to me when reaching director-level roles, something I know a lot of my fellow hags have also experienced.
Not that I hadn't been diminished and told to smile earlier in my career. I definitely have (and worse). But as I progressed, I experienced a kind of increased psychological double-dealing. The only way I can explain it is that as a director or above, you pose more of a threat.
Obviously different people will have different experiences. But at least for me and a lot of others I know, this kind of stuff can get worse in some ways with seniority, not better.
Thank you for this, Elana. I'm stuck in the middle part, where aggressiveness is frowned upon, even as male colleagues around me are rewarded for the same behavior. It's hard to stay motivated.
I feel a lot of this in my bones. Thank you for writing on it. Depressingly, the modern workplace - and society - is still set up to see men as natural leaders, and women as their natural supporters.
Completely with you and Adam Grant in terms of the effectiveness of 'weak language' (and a sign of EQ) and I recognise him as an ally in helping women progress + receive equal opportunities. Nevertheless that NYT article of his on the topic kinda irritated me a little. I wrote about why on my own Substack - would love to know what anyone else interested in this topic thinks: https://emmakriskinans.substack.com/p/the-business-book-all-working-women
Thank you for sharing. I was told I was "too aggressive" and "too competitive" earlier in my career as an IC and it was truly unfair. Now as an exec, it's seen as "assertive" and valued.
This made me smile! We can all connect to these for-your-own-good-and-personal-growth feedback about "softening up", smiling more, being less direct.
Not sure when I decided to own it and make it part about my introduction: I am direct, assertive, this is how I engage and communicate and these are my strengths. Freeing!
I feel the pain, especially earlier in my career and family life. However, as my kids grow up, I find myself falling into another trap - team mom. The one who manages everyone's feelings and cleans up all the messes. I read another woman called it the "work housework".
This article really highlights the no win situation of middle management especially for women. Your story should give others the confidence to know you can push through, you just need an organisation worthy of your talents.
The *most* relatable as always. thanks Elena!
The feminist in me doesn’t want to take your advice - it’s sad that women have to modify their language so as not to offend men. We can’t smile too much because that make us look weak but we can’t be assertive either. As usual, we can’t fulfill either expectation. As another poster said, the rules of this game need to change.
I think ‘weak language’ is probably someone everyone should learn (guys and girls) 👀 All of the harshness can get quite exhausting. Even for men, I bet!
I’ve gone through the highs and lows myself (too assertive, too junior, too this and that). This post could’ve saved me time. I’ll be recommending it.